Pennsylvania Votes Forum

Wm, please say more about why you think this is the case.

1) Specifically, how does PA HB 300 perpetuate racism and bigotry? Please be specific and explain why you feel this way.

2) Why do you feel  that PA HB 300 should be considered from a perspective of "best interest of children."

These are two claims I have not heard before, and would appreciate a better understanding of these as a position against PA HB 300.

Thx,

tcwaters:

Wm, please say more about why you think this is the case.

I think WM was referring to fabulouslulu's post ;)

I stand corrected, or re-oriented. Or both. Thanks for getting me sorted out.

 Not nice of you to make fun of my name...Isn't that something those on your side of the fence frown upon?

Racism: Sexual preference is not the same as race. You can be a former homosexual/***/bisexual/whatever, but not formerly black, Hispanic, Asian, etc.

Children are entitled to a mother and a father. Same sex couples deprive children of either from the get go.

You are perpetuating legal enforcement of an idea which is not shared by most people. Sounds like bullying to me.

Say More:

http://www.delcotimes.com/articles/2009/06/05/opinion/doc4a28a2bab9183833864047.txt

Gil Spencer is blaming Dr. George Tiller for his own murder.  He has a curious way of doing this by qualifying it as a justifiable assassination.   Spencer says that Tiller killed himself.

Note the link to John Wilkes Booth whose rationalization for killing Abraham Lincoln was that the slaves had been freed and would be given the right to vote. 

Note the link to Jesse James’ killing by defining both the killer and the killed as undesirables with the one being forgiven the public was happy to have the other done with. 

Note the link to the Kennedy killings.

Is Spencer really equating all of these murders?

Note the posted comments.  They point to the undercurrent of prejudice and bigotry in our culture that can rationalize any act, including murder and torture, of those who disagree or offend.   George Bush’s war on Iraq was launched and has been conducted on the same rationalizations that Gil Spencer uses to rationalize the killing of Dr. Tiller. 

Iraq brought it on itself.  Jesse James brought it on himself.  Abraham Lincoln brought it on himself.  The Kennedys brought it on themselves.

It is sad that a community newspaper gives Gil Spencer the podium to spout his distorted and poisonous mindset.  It would be like giving a skin-head the microphone or the suicide bomber.

To quote George Carlin, “My interest in ‘issues’ is merely to point out how badly we’re doing, not to suggest a way we might do better.  Don’t confuse me with those who cling to hope.”

Wm.

That people like Spencer can say al of this is one of the price's of liberty. Freedom of Speech, grants the same rights to crackpots as it does to the wise. I wish the same could be said for protections in housing, employment and public accommodations in Pennsylvania. Here, it is acceptable to discriminate against some but not others. No equal protection under the law exists in these areas. PA HB 300 can go a long way towards bringing that level of equality in protection. We will still have to deal with the crazy speech, but I'd say liberty is worth it.

 I am very sorry to read your take on this Bill. HB 300 is not taking any rights away from anyone. In fact it gives individuals the right to not be discriminated against by real radicals, through including sexual orientation and gender identity in the state's human relations act. I am a tax paying, law abiding citizen of this state and this nation. Why should I not have the same rights and protections as others? Was our nation not founded on the ideas of freedom and equality for all people? How could you be so full of hate? The so called "Gay Agenda" is not in fact an agenda at all....Most responsible and intelligent individuals agree that the right of marriage, hospital visitation, tax and social security benefits and job protections among many other things are things that all citizens of this land of freedom and justice for ALL deserve. I would hope that your need for hate and true immoral actions would be changed and you would understand that while you have the right for freedom of speech and the right of freedom of religion, I have the right to marry and the pursuit of happiness like you.

 Glenner87, apparently I was confusing in my statements or you read what I said backwards. 

Yes, our nation was founded on the principal of equality for all persons, although it has taken more than 200 years to even begin living up to this premise.  We are not there yet.  And it will be a fight to accomplish this truth.  Every person does have, should have and must have the same rights, freedoms, choices, opportunities, etc.  These are not privileges that require legislation.  These are ours simply because we exist.  All of humankind is equal regardless of their gender, their birth place or their birth parents.  It is a pity that some would deny this fact.  It is a pity that these things require discussion and passage into law.  We must banish prejudice, bigotry and racism of every kind.  We must do this or we will be nothing.

I recommend the book for explanation of my view, Covering: The Hidden Assault on Our Civil Rights by Kenji Yoshino

Wm. H. Evans

Thx for the book recomendation, and sorry I misunderstood an earlier post.

Anyone interested in and concerned about civil, human and natural rights should read this well written and very sensitive book.  I heard the author speak which prompted my purchase.  It is difficult to comprehend the lack of rights until you hear from someone who lacks them.  Also recommend 'Does a Tree have Standing'